Safety
 

Do you guys actually use your Safety, aside from in the staging area?

Personaly, If I am on a patrol or dont "expect" to make contact I have my safety on.

Seems I may be one of the rare guys who actually do it though... There must be some guys here who use both RS and Airsoft and have kept that good habit.

Whenever I'm out and about, if at any time I'm expecting to possibly make contact, my safety is off and my finger is alongside the trigger guard. Aside from that, my AEGs are on safe.

when I'm on the feild I have my gun on semi and my finger off the trigger, I have had a couple instances where I am confronted and bring up my gun to shoot them and *click* forgot the safty is on.

i am either on safety or on semi with my finger off the trigger and beside the guard

When i get mine i wonte put a mag in the well till i get to the field and a game is starting..

depending on the type of game, I'll be on safe until I'm ready to fire.

I think he is asking if you will have safty on when you are on the feild but not in combat.

When travelling outside the wire, safety off, finger outside the trigger guard.

I also consider it important not sweaping my friends with my musle.

Well yeah, the safety should be on always when the guns not in use..

But the question being asked is when entering the fire zone where possible contacts may be engaged. Some would consider that "in use" but the questions is whether people have the safety clicked on until the moment they see an enemy combatant to switch it to semi/full auto.

Personally as soon as I leave the safe zone Im in either semi or full auto. Its happened a couple times with me also that I'd see an enemy and fail to take the shot as I forgot the safety on and I get killed in turn.

I think the poll should be locked before the pornbots show up.

Thanks for your reply guys. It seems its pretty 50/50 regarding this topic. I guess that once you get used to the fact that your safety IS on, you will always remember to switch it off before engaging the target. It really doesnt take any extra time...

Unless I am expecting some sort of contact any moment or if I am in the middle of a fire fight my gun is on safe. I found when I first starting playing that my finger would find the trigger too easily when hiking through the bush and several times I tripped and I actaully gave my position away by actually hitting the trigger and firing the gun at the ground or into the air.

I was one of the guys at claybank who fired about 1 mag total. The rest of the time mag not in the magwell, weapon hanging on sling.

Safety is on in safe zone with mag out. In game semi only, mag in and finger out of trigger guard at the START of the game....its a cqc place I play at so I have my finger on the trigger any other time when playing

seekah...I understand what you meant...

I know most people here don't have their safety on while in the field. It's a bit strange, isn't it?

I thought in real life combat, we don't put safety off until engaging the enemy to avoid accidents. Maybe I'm a bit old school (1990s)? Has the rule been changed recently in combat?

Gun up on target, safety off, gun down, safety on.

It's muscle memory, you just need to practice it.

On Semi, finger away from the trigger in game.
Off game, safety, no mag, clear the barrel.

Thats exactly it. It goes you more time to decide if your engaging friendly or foe, it also gives you time to decide if semi is all you need, or if full auto is better suited.

If any of you guys plan on moving to real steal, and plan on doing any tactical courses, I highly suggest you start developing that muscle memory.

If you're worried that you won't get the safety off in time to engage a target...

Practice, practice, practice.

Soon enough you'll be so used to it, that you won't even notice there's a safety.

It's good to get in the habit now, you never know when you'll make appearance at a gun range for some plinking.

When I'm in the field and not expecting to be engaging targets,,,,I switch to semi with finger off the trigger. Only because you never know where the enemy is, and i've been in the situation where I've had to react to a missed shot and a quick double tap to keep heads down while I escape/evade has been a godsend.

Big thing being sudden ambush from close range and dealing with it, is enough to dive for cover and figure out what is going on, nearest cover and such, and being at the ready out of safe mode with finger off trigger is one less thing to deal with. Also explains, besides ammo usage, why those experienced ones that use Armalites use semi often, the Armalite selector is a pain to move to full auto as it is with a shooting grip, let alone during high stress while under fire.

My VSR doesn't have a safety...

But I've got the trigger pull set to about 6-7 pounds.

My M24 doesn't either, and has a heavy trigger pull too, but is lighter and smoother than Piper's Remington 700 lightweight .308 hunting (sorry Joe, SNIPER) rifle! I was surprised at this, I thought I had a very heavy trigger pull until I started shooting his rifle, then found out what an annoyingly bad trigger pull is.

Full auto, however my FAMAS has basically two safetys so I can leave the trigger guard one on while the selector switch is set to auto and jam my finger in to turn it off and fire in a second.
My M14 on the other hand also has a trigger guard located safety so I tend to keep it on and have a finger ready to turn it off at a moments notice

While actually in game I'm on full auto with my finger outside the guard. When I'm actually engaging the enemy my finger is on the trigger riding the break. On the way to respawn or any other situation where I'm in the game area but not playing it's on safe. In the safe zone safety on, mag out and barrel cleared.

This. It also prevents all instances of "I would have had you but my safety was on."

I second this one. With practice it can be done just as quickly and is a very good safety and weapon skill that is transferable to other airsoft and real steel.

except my woc is stiff as hell to turn safety, I can do safe to semi, semi to safe basically sight on sight off type now, but auto to safe....gotta get my index finger to move all the way back so my thumb can extend far enough to push it to semi then safe. Oh god, I really cant understand why they made the default M4/M16 on sided selector.

Always have my gun on safe then switch to semi when the SHTF. Though, the few times I've used uncivilized guns (AK) I find proper safety use impossible and it had to stay on semi all the time (a contributing factor to my distaste in them).

Safety is ON whenever I'm in transit- back to base, respawn, safe area.

If I am in the field, in play- my finger is the only safety. When split seconds count, and I never know when I may encounter an opposing player, I'm not going to be messed up by forgetting to turn safety off.

I just remember 2 personal rules:

1. Never point your gun at anything that you are not willing to shoot. (Always be aware, like with RS, "if this gun went off right now, what would it hit?")

2. The most important safety is your finger. (Rest it on or above the trigger guard, pull it into position only when ready to fire- this takes about .002 seconds)

semi for me... dont want to be attacked and then forget about the safety. also, if i do accidentally pull the trigger, its just one bb flying out not 20 if it were on full auto :)

When on the field and not expecting combat my AR is on safe.

If expecting contact, i switch to semi.

Rarely on auto.

So what your saying is that your AR never leaves your house?

Cool thanks.

if anyone's seen Magpul Dynamics, both Costa and Travis actually flick off/on the safety after every small engagement.

I found that quite neat. It's an excellent demonstration of their proficiency in the armalite weapon.

However that being said, I only have my safety on when I'm not expecting contact. I believe this is pretty much the same for everybody with minimal common sense.

Military training makes me keep on safe when not on target. It's just something i keep in practice with airsoft.... especially after i won a 1 on 1 game with my brother when he shot himself in the foot while running from me......

It's second nature to put the weapon selector to fire when preparing to shoot...because it's on safe otherwise.

Once you've built putting the selector into fire (semi first typically) as part of the movements of bringing the weapon up to aim...it becomes so quick it's not something thought of consciously. Having your thumb resting close (or on) the selector lever as it's in safe makes it really convenient to flick it to semi as you close your strong hand grip for aiming/firing.

On the other end of the firing sequence, if you practice putting your rifle into safe everytime your bring it down out of aim/firing position...then you never f*ck up your aiming sequence.

Doing so...you never should have to guess as to what satus your rifle is in (i.e. fire? or safe?)...you know that when it's not shouldered it's safe...when you're ready to fire it's on fire. You don't have to look, glance, peek at it. You don't have to worry/sweat that your rifle is going to go off as you creep/crawl through the brush.

And as the best side product of doing it this way...the rifle is on safe (not the safest condition, but at least safer than ready-to-fire) when you're moving/hanging with your teammates. Shooting them on purpose when it's called for is one thing ;)...shooting them accidentally just makes you look like an idiot.

I'm more of an armalite guy...so this is pretty natural for M4's and similar with my FAL. I guess that it'd be different to do with an AK since the selector typically has to be manipulated with the off hand and requires contorsions or turning the rifle over.

I don't have my gun yet, so this is only what I think I'll do. If I feel I won't encounter somebody for whatever reason, it'll ben on safe. But if just might encounter a bad guy, I will have it on semi, but finger off the trigger, alongside the trigger guard. I would not put the gun on full auto, unless I feel it would really be necessary. I would set in to auto in the heat of battle, and put it back on semi as soon as I don't need auto anymore.

I guess it's a good thing that I did this right off the bat. I even wondered if it was normal at the game I went to.

Started looking around to see what was "right."

I am always on the Safety unless i really know there will be shit hitting the fan right now lol.

When i see a contact i switch to semi then back to safe.
I wont shoot myself in the leg like that :p

In my first game, I lost the opportunity to score my first kill because my gun was on safety. I pressed as hard as I could on the trigger thinking it was broken until we both surrendered ourselves and I realized that my gun was on safe.

So now, I keep my gun between safe and semi. Most of the time when I going through really difficult terrain (which is most of the time), I keep it on safe. Its only when I know someone (friend or foe) is close by that I switch over to semi. I don't understand the people who have to use auto when semi is good enough. Guess they just want to inflict pain to piss someone off or waste money on bbs that could be used for other/more kills in the future (but that's coming from a poor full-time student).

mines always on safe unless im about to shoot and thats just because ive been lit up too many time in safe zones. and because its good practice.

gun on auto, finger alongside the trigger guard. if you know where your muzzle is pointed, and your finger is off the trigger, then i think a safety is pointless when your on patrol or moving to contact. it'll put one more barrier between you and shooting the enemy. of course at the same time its a good idea when your covering rough ground or crossing a fence etc.

of course we're talking about airsoft here so its a lot more fuckitwhynot than anybody carrying rs would be.

Yeah with RS it's damned important as a branch or your vest my fire your weapon and kill your buddy. In airsoft no real big to do what Flea_ish said.... though good practice to use safeties.

Safe
 

Common practice to keep wepon on safe and mag out in safe zones, they may not be RS but accidents still happen (had a buddy take a round in the eye cause of an NG). In combat, what ever works, personally keep safety on unless expecting contact, and finger outside the guard.

Muzzle control and trigger control are what I use. Gun on semi when playing a game, basically at all times - minus a few instances when I've engaged in a firefight and either know exactly where my enemies are, or I have no idea where potential ambushers are and I'm spraying in the general direction of incoming fire and hoping to notice a flinch somewhere (okay, maybe more than "a few"). In these cases, short bursts are sort-of warranted, IMO.

Then again, I don't run with an Armalite - I find that the HK placement of the safety on the G3 keeps the selector out of the way of any stray thumbs or fingers, thus making it harder for me to constantly switch from safe to semi, and especially from safe to full-auto. Armalite's are a different story - the placement of the safety and shape of the safety allowed me to constantly switch from safe to semi (during the few times I did shoot with these, though in a non-skirmish setting). Perhaps someone can tell me how to better utilize the safety on an HK...?

On handguns, I find that trigger control is second nature - with DA/SA, I safely decock the hammer before holstering the weapon, and I make sure to keep my trigger finger away from the trigger area when presenting the sidearm. With SA only, I've trained myself to disengage a 1911-type safety during a draw, while getting a firm grip to disengage the grip safety as well. In this way, I have (so far) avoided any accident discharges.

It's dynamic to the situation, but I typically leave it on semi.
Safe in safe zones obviously
I leave it in full auto when I'm expecting to get ambushed or engage in close quarters

Safety is on before a skirmish or during a "break" in said skirmish. I have solely been using an AK variant of one type or another for the better part of last season. Auto is where the slector is at during any sort of play unless I switch to semi for a particular purpose. Finger is alongside the trigger guard, muzzle direction is controlled.

As support for my team, I WILL be on full auto and mechanical safeties off when the scenario is on. They depend on me as their 'safety' to provided cover. Anything else is poor planning on my part and would violate the trust my teammates place in me to cover them so they can get to cover.

Muzzle control first, Trigger discipline second as mechanical safeties fail.

For me this is reinforced by the protocols used during some of our live weapon scenario training with the military. Range time is cool, but engagement scenarios is where its at.

At the first such scenario I attended, when I mentioned having the safety on when moving from one encounter to the next, the Brit RI gave me this disbelieving sidelook (I think of disgust), and put that thought ta bed in one.

'Your mates is depending on you, right?. If they need lead downrange NOW, they don't need it a second from now! Got it?"

"Yes sir!"

"Don't call me sir, my parents knew each other!"

safety on untill i here the first shots then to semi with finger under the trigger guard then safety on when im hit

I've perfected a technique that could prove useful to anyone.

It's similar to what LAPD's SWAT is trained to do. I keep my rifle pointing at a downward angle when moving and when not aiming, but if I need to fire, while raising the rifle to the firing position, I flip it from safe to semi.

Unless your going to fire the gun in the next 10 seconds, it should be in the safe position. Simple as that.

lolz
http://www.xdtalk.com/gallery/data/509/Hoot.JPG

I generally keep mine on semi once i think the enemy may be close....ive gotten killed too many times from when someone jumped me and i cudnt shoot because my gun was stuck on safety. I put it on semi cause one shots all i need and if i accidentally shoot it only lets one go.

I am one of those who makes sure my AEG or GBB is cleared and mag out when off the field and only put a mag in when I am on the field. Better safe then sorry... while on the field I practice finger off the trigger until ready to engage a target... gun always pointed down until ready to go.

depends on a few factors. one weapon type, if im using my AK cause its a bitch to use the selector i just leave it on semi, if on the other hand im using a AR style rifle i will use safe unless i expect contact or im close to the opfor base. hell i dont use full auto alot unless im in real trouble most of the time 2-3 quick semi's and i disengage.

this.
guns on full auto, low ready, finger outside the trigger guard, don't want a click click damn it safety is on,

Safe zone = mag out, safety on
non-safe zone = mag in, full auto with a round chambered (I need to chamber a round with my Tar21)

50% of people on safe at all time? I call BS on that!

for my part, I'm on semi, and I switch to auto only when I need to.

of course in safe zones its safety on and mags out. but this a general field rule anyway.

I usually always put my gun on safe unless I'm in the battlefield or playing area. It's a habit I got used to, but a friend questions me about it.

In the safe zone it's mag out, chamber cleared.

Out on the feild I have the weapon cocked, safety on. All you guys sayng you forget to take the safety off need to get your shit in order and develop some muscle memory on the use of your weapon

I like what my firearms instructor told me many years ago. He was former British Royal Marine. He drilled it into us that all guns are loaded, a round in the chamber and that there is no mechanical safety on the gun. As such, only time the gun is "safe" is while its still in my hands after I removed the magazine, cycled the action, locked the bolt to the rear and visually inspected the barrel and action for ammunition. The moment I set that gun down, its loaded again, and must be reinspected start to finish.

So long story short, I've never used a mechanical safety on a firearm. If your in the middle of a day of hunting, or your in the middle of a paintball or airsoft match, your safety doesn't exist. The moment you leave the hunting area, paintball field etc, magazines/hoppers out and safety on but other then that the safety doesn't exist.

Dimitri

Err... If you handle a gun with safety I seriously hope you're using it. Even when I finish shooting I always remove mag and cycle the bolt carrier to make sure it's empty then I it's a press on trigger (I use a HK417).
I "drill" in my trainees that a gun is always to be considered loaded and should always be on safe until you intend to shoot. I saw enough accident to kick the ass of whatever dork who doesn't use it. Especially when I'm the one held responsible.

I apply the same rule on my GBBR, trigger pull is a lot shorter then on AEG, the more the reason to use it, even on my sidearm.

I think the guy ahead of you is trying to say is the safety is not a reliable way to make sure the weapon does not fire. The only safety is the shooter maintaining control of the weapon.

You have to be aware of where the muzzle is 100% of the time and not casually sweep someone because "it's on safe".

Those people shot by malfunctioning Remington rifles would be alive and unhurt if the person with the rifle had paid attention to this rule.

Press the trigger? You just made a very unsafe move. Cause at the end of the day, you are assuming that the chamber is empty, cause the moment you can't visually inspect the chamber you don't know if its loaded or not. Your assumption that you did everything right is the only thing that "proves" that the rifle was empty.

Which is why firearm companies have made plastic "flags" for years for the bolts of rifles that can be inserted to prove that there is no round in the chamber, and be still visible from the outside of the rifle. And why they are mandatory at many ranges and especially shooting competitions.

Exactly. Muzzle control, treating the firearm as its loaded and ready to shoot all the time, and common sense is what is the only reliable way to make sure it will not fire and kill someone by "accident", but at the end of the day there are no accidents, just negligence of the user causing death. Which is a crime by the way.

Take the M1 Garand, M14, and the civilian models the SAI M1A and the Norinco M305/M14S, they have a very reliable mechanical safety, except for the fact its activated in the trigger guard. Which makes the possibility of accidentally hitting the trigger possible. Other guns, say the Mauser actions with its rear of the bolt 2 and 3 position safeties have been known to slip the firing pin forward just enough that the round gets fired.

Either way, assuming a mechanical safety will work, is like assuming your brand new car will last past the 3 year warranty. It would be nice if both were true, but that is not always the case.

Dimitri

For the HK417 thing few word before "make sure it's empty", I'm not mad enough to press trigger without verifying that. It's merely that I don't like having the hammer cocked for storage/transport.

I know the safety is not 100% sure thing, especially if the guy does not watch the wear on the trigger assembly. Once saw a guy in semi, shot the first round, the entire mag got depleted because of old components... hopefully we were on shooting range and not walking or whatever.
Yet the safety is here so "better safe then sorry". ;)

Actually what he did is the golden standard of firearms safety across most modern shooting competitions and militaries.
"Show clear and hammer down" is the only way to ensure the firearm is clear and not cocked.
If you clear a chamber visually or by feel then you know its clear, if you are uncertain at all then you clear it again (the cycle twice and look rule).

This is a big boy rule and as such is not suitable for everyone. If you are uncomfortable dropping the hammer on a chamber you have cleared then it isn't suitable for you, which doesn't make it unsafe for everyone.

-Grant

Easing springs is pretty much a flat out rule for any firearm. Sometimes you'll remove parts before doing so but it's not a new thing.

Except RO's get edgy cause then they got to trust you unloaded the firearm. But a open and visible bolt or a chamber flag can show all the rifles being cleared. The DCRA requires a chamber flag for service rifle as does most others hosting competitions. Also the same rule for the Canadian Forces and the international service condition competitions.

Which is also for F-Class around these parts.

Danke,

Mechanically, a spring doesn't know when it is compressed or extended. Your average spring is actually always under compression, due to the fact till a preload is applied to the spring it is not consistent. Due to the varying extended lengths every time it completely extends.

None the less back to my point. Mechanically a spring fatigues due to cycling not compression unless its compression is over 50% and no design pushes that limit as permanent failure of the material occurs the first time.

Dimitri

The smaller the spring, the more it sacks out under load. It's the old physics joke personified. "I know it works in reality but how does it work in theory".

my mp40 does not have a safety persay (with trigger control, you can fire in semi while being in auto)

So my mp40 is always in auto, in the safe zone - I simply remove the mag and fire in semi to remove the last BB lodged in the barrel before entering the safe zone.

Valid for square range use only. You won't see an empty chamber indicator in an action shooting sport or operational environment.
I shoot silhouette, chamber flags are required and as such I use one. Square range with square range rules, plus going striker forward with some rimfires is poor form. Outside of that competition they are a nuisance and nothing more.

No need for an RO to get edgy, the line officers watch the shooters clear their weapons before the line goes green. Movement on the range is allowed and all weapons are handled as though loaded.

Its like a safety/FCS. It doesn't allow you to handle the weapon in any way differently, but it creates an additional mechanical roadblock to an ND in event of missed-footing or loss of balance.
Plus you ensured it was operational when you picked-up your weapon and did a function check, right? For what I do I damn well better be confident that my weapon will not fire in the safe position.

-Grant